View Full Version : Got My Shirt In The Mail, But........

John Orchard
September 26th, 2001, 07:45 AM
....I think they must have accidentally sent me Brian Whalen's shirt, it's got his name all over it!? What gives...

[ September 26, 2001: Message edited by: John O #851 ]

September 26th, 2001, 11:02 AM
John, (et all)

We had NO useable artwork from the last printing of the T-Shirts. So I volunteered my time and talent and spent 6+ hours recreating the entire front and back of the the shirt from a sample picture, in Illustrator. As is appeared this way before from the other artist, I put my name and URL under the back in the same manner as the original, as the former designer was unable to be located and was no help in providing us duplicate art.

I'm sorry if you don't like my name in the "by line" but I felt it was fair for my effort.

Sorry it bugs you.


John Orchard
September 26th, 2001, 12:51 PM
Interesting....There are several points that could be made here, but none more relevant than this one....

I had a buddy in high school who copied and turned in an English essay originally written by someone else, but in his own hand writing. Somehow the teacher just couldn't see her way to giving him credit for the assignment!

It's all water under the bridge at this point, but maybe just somethin' to consider next time around.

[ September 26, 2001: Message edited by: John O #851 ]

September 26th, 2001, 01:50 PM
Great points John. I concur.


September 26th, 2001, 04:03 PM

I appreciate your implication that I'm a plagiarist. That's a real warm & fuzzy. As you look at your shirt, it says "Artwork: Brian Whalen" and before it said "Original art: Whatshisface". I never said I was the CREATOR. Would you have prefered: Digitally Remasterer, or Artwork Recreator?

I simply deserved a byline for my effort to supplying that artwork used (re-created, yes) from a simple watercolor image to make the vector art needed to produce shirts. Do I expect credit for the idea? No. Did I expect people who've already seen the design to believe that "I" created it years ago, before I even joined. No. Do I expect credit for the effort to supply this to the club. Hell-ya.

As I recall, I freelance this **** for a living, and at nearly 7 hours at $50/hr, that would have been about $350 the club saved if some other poor graphic designer slob had to do it, or Emily could have found the guy who created the pic in the first place. AND,finally, I did it in 2 long nights so you could get them on time.

Call the name and URL payment for services.

So what's the problem girls? Would you rather NOT have any new shirts? No artwork means a nice white blank Hanes Beefy T. Christ.

You guys make me sick.

Do a favor for free and I get blasted for it.

Go find some other tree to **** on.
This one's not bending.

September 26th, 2001, 05:25 PM
Albert - thanks for letting us use your garage for the tire changer for free.
I would hate to see the "service" bill for rental of your garage space.

You are my hero.

John Orchard
September 27th, 2001, 07:01 AM
Oh puh-lease Brian!! Take a deep breath, relax and pull your panties out of your *** for a sec! No one is trying to "**** on your tree" here. I've simply tried to point out something that I consider an error in your judgement. Initially, I was giving you the benefit of the doubt. I not going to call you names or get emotional, but there are a couple of more points worth mentioning.

First of all, you're using semantics to try and justify the fact that you removed the rightful creator's name from the artwork and inserted yours. There are just no two ways about that one. Look at how strongly you feel that you deserve to have your name at the bottom of this artwork for the time you spent re-creating the image. Now take a step back and consider for a second how the guy who created this artwork is gonna feel when he finds out his name was removed entirely!

Inserting your name once at the bottom of this thing might be understandable, but having it twice at the bottom is at best nothing more than over the top self-promotion. You however, took things a step further and removed all reference to the to the creator of the artwork. Whether you meant to or not, since your name is the only one associated with the artwork on the shirt, you are taking credit for all aspects of the design and that is in fact plagiarism.

One last point. When you volunteer for something that means you are donating you time, free of charge. Your assertion that you deserve to have your name at the bottom not once, but twice - as "payment for your services", kinda flies in the face of the spirit of volunteering.

September 27th, 2001, 08:05 AM

In hind sight, from your accusations, and to remove all doubt that I did not create that image originally, I should have put the name (Addison) in on the left, and my self under Graphics: Brian (www.whalendesign.com)

As far as needing credit, I've had several WrenchFests at my place, changed tires with folks on numerous occasions, rebuilt forks, setup suspensions, and other things for club members that I never asked for any recognition for. This was one isolated time, and you've made me out to be a criminal becuase I didn't have the original artist's name on there. My intention was never to take credit for the design, just my work to recreate.

You choose to look at this in one light. That I deliberately decided to take credit for a design that I did not create from an original idea. I'm really sorry that you feel this way. The fact that had to change many things about that design in order to make it work in four colors means that is really NOT the same image as it was. I had to re-draw many areas in different colors to make it work. It's different in many ways. I'm sorry you are offended, and the rest of you.

I thought it would be obvious that I didn't create that orignally. Like seeing a copy of a Manet, or a litho of something else. It a copy. It's not the original. I know that. The club know's that.

The bottom line: I wanted cedit for what I did. Not that I pirate other's ideas.

You can always send me your shirt, and I'm happy to buy it off you.


John Orchard
September 27th, 2001, 09:20 AM
Bri - one more thing to consider.....DFW chapter bad *** and wheelie god Mitch, donated his time and effort to create and draw a design for TSBA shirts from last year. His name is no where to be found on the shirt and he didn't ask for anything in return for his time other than a free shirt (cost to the club, roughly $10), yet, EVERYONE in the club knows that it's Mitch's work! The dude's a class act all the way!

It's water under the bridge at this point, so no biggie. Sounds like you've got it covered for next time around which was my reason for bringing it up in the first place.

For what it's worth, the shirts look real sharp! smile.gif

September 27th, 2001, 10:38 AM

I'm glad we see that this is not a major issue to loose sleep over. I have nothing but priase for our last T-Shirt's. While I see your point about Mitch, I can only say it's a shame, he didn't put his name on it. He deserves the recongnition for all his effort for the club. It's a very well done work. That was his choice though. He's not a saint because he decided not to put his name on his donated work. He just made the choice that he'd prefer to remain anonymous.

I love this club for one major reason: We love bikes as a group, but put aside lots of issues (bike brand, location, opinion) when it comes down to brass tacks, and help each other out. No questions asked. That's why I'm a member.

Peace Brotha.